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    Username Post: What knife to buy? - Masanobu?        (Topic#879431)
    usxlim
    Member
    *
    05-31-10 00:07.21 - Post#2140100    



    Hello all

    Thank you for all the information and initial advice above. Taking each of the "What knife to buy" questions in turn -

    What are you looking for in your knife -

    Something to carve joints of roast as well as a bit of fish slicing on the side - porterhouse, cote de beuf, shoulder of lamb / pork, etc.

    What knife are you currently using that you are looking to replace or partner with -

    Currently using an 8 inch Sabatier Chef's Knife and a Utility Knife by WMF (that has its tip bent out of shape ...).

    How do you grip the knife -

    I think you call it the 'pinch grip'

    Do you prefer the knife balanced, more handle heavy or blade heavy -

    Balanced or handle heavy historically.

    Do you like a tall or short blade -

    Looking for a slicer, so I suppose short?

    Do you want it thin, heavy or something in between -

    Thinner than the German / French knives.

    Do you prefer a flatter edge or more curvy -

    Flatter

    What handle shape would you like -

    Western? Does the Wa handle take much to get used to?

    What handle materials are you looking for -

    Doesn't matter.

    What budget constraints do you have -

    sub USD 300 ish?

    What sharpening equipment do you have -

    tend to just send the knives for sharpening, thinking of buying a few stones though.

    What other special features / accessories would you like -

    Some damascus cladding?

    What type of steel -

    VG-10 or similar stainless steel (Aogami etc a bit too much care required at this stage).


    Finally, someone recommended this, and its available in the UK and a minimal mark-up compared to Korin. Anyone has experience with Masanobus?
    http://korin.com/Masanobu-VG-10-Dam...
     


    DwarvenChef
    Master Member KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 00:20.40 - Post#2140104    


        In response to usxlim

    Welcom to the Kitchen

    I'm going to have to bow out of this one as you seem to want the shiny stuff... /shudder... I'm in line with the dark side of the steel Aogami is my friend
     
    Marko Tsourkan
    Master Member KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 03:16.17 - Post#2140162    


        In response to DwarvenChef

    • DwarvenChef Said:
    Welcom to the Kitchen

    I'm going to have to bow out of this one as you seem to want the shiny stuff... /shudder... I'm in line with the dark side of the steel Aogami is my friend



    Got to agree with DC
     
    hoopla-pdx
    Master Member KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 04:29.21 - Post#2140191    


        In response to usxlim

    The Masanobu is made by MCUSTA. I haven't handled the Masanobu, but the ZANMAI knives are very well made. They have a unique handle that is very close to a traditional octagaon and with some of the flourishes found on extremely high end Japanese knives. For that fit-and-finish, care in grinding, and handle, you pay a pretty big premium over other VG-10 knives.

    I also have a Shun Elite 'slicer', which is stainless (SG2) and an excellent knife. With it, you are paying a fair amount for the PM steel. Have you looked at/handled any Shun's? The 'Classic' chef's knife has a German shape, which you probably don't want, but the slicer is probably fine.

    You could also look at getting something less expensive and, maybe, getting a gyuto as well. The fit-and-finish doesn't compare, but you could get both in Tojiro DP and have quite a bit of change.

     
    Adagimp
    Master Member KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 04:47.54 - Post#2140200    


        In response to usxlim

    Mark at Chefknivestogo has some nice options coming in soon http://www.chefknivestogo.com/wishl...

    Also bluewayjapan on ebay has bargain wa options.
     
    a8bil
    Journeyman KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 06:39.40 - Post#2140255    


        In response to usxlim

    I have their 270 gyuto (non-damascus). Thin geometry. Very high quality craftsmanship. Solid performance for a stainless blade. Definitely has some "bling" quality to it.


    I have never used the forum Hattori sujihiki, but I would imagine it provides similar performance to the Masanobu if you want a western handle.

    http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/H...
     
    HelloMrFancyPants
    Member KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 13:28.30 - Post#2140466    


        In response to a8bil

    I've got a Hattori FH suji, and it is my favorite SS suji. The 270 is particularly versatile because it has a decent height so it can chop pretty well near the handle.
     
    Aphex
    Journeyman KnifeNut!
    *
    05-31-10 14:18.56 - Post#2140503    


        In response to usxlim

    Hi there,

    After looking at your list of requests, i think maybee this Sujihiki (Japanese version of a slicer) by Kanetsune that's VG-10 with damascus cladding $200 may suit your bill.

    http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives...

    Perhaps you could get a couple of stones with the savings.
     
    usxlim
    Member
    *
    06-01-10 05:27.54 - Post#2140789    


        In response to Aphex

    Thanks for the suggestions so far!

    The following Kanetsune's look like they might do the trick -

    http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives...

    http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives...

    What I am trying to understand is why a Mcusta (Masanobu / Zenmai) is so much more expansive?

    How do the companies (or anyone buying them)justify the differential given that the steel core of the Kanetsunes are very similar to what the Mcusta knife uses (VG10/19C27/VG10)?

    http://korin.com/Masanobu-VG-10-Dam...
     
    C9
    Master Member KnifeNut!
    *
    06-01-10 05:39.59 - Post#2140794    


        In response to usxlim

    • usxlim Said:
    Thanks for the suggestions so far!

    The following Kanetsune's look like they might do the trick -

    http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives...

    http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives...

    What I am trying to understand is why a Mcusta (Masanobu / Zenmai) is so much more expansive?

    How do the companies (or anyone buying them)justify the differential given that the steel core of the Kanetsunes are very similar to what the Mcusta knife uses (VG10/19C27/VG10)?

    http://korin.com/Masanobu-VG-10-Dam...



    Because they have fancy handles, and they actually paid a product designer to do some product designing.

    Steel isn't the only thing that makes a good knife either, why would you pay hundreds of dollars for a Blue #2 Watanabe, when you can get a Tosagata for less money? Why would you buy a Tadatsuna made from GIN-3 when you can get a Hiromoto GIN-3 for less money? Why would you buy the new DT ITK knife even though its made from the same AEB-L as the Grand Cheff?

    Steel is one of the easiest "technical" things to market, but the steel will no cut itself just due to its nature. If I make a hammer out of VG-10, its obviously going to be a lousy knife, so that presents the most important aspect of cutting performance, the form, or what is often referred to as cross sectional geometry. Companies will tell you that the knife is sharpened at a 15* angle, but that only tells you part of the story. Theres the whole area right behind the edge which impacts cutting performance. Obviously, it you take a 1" thick sheet of metal and put a 15* edge on it, the cross section is probably going to look more akin to an axe than a knife.

    Theres also the heat treat, while you need a good steel to hold that 15* angle, it needs to be heat treated well, as well. A poor heat treat can lead to the knife being too soft, or too brittle, or have a plethora of various problems, and cutlery steel is nothing without a proper heat treat. There are even special heat treatments that bring out more potential from the steel rather than using the standard cheap and easy heat treatments. Even the best steel in the world is going to make a lousy knife if left in its annealed and unhardened state.
     


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