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Username Post: Scagel Large Bowie-Chopping Test
Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
01-28-12 11:41.37 - Post#2436804    

Scagel Large Bowie Chopping & Batoning Maplewood.


Since I got the Large Bowie, I have been curious how it will cope with chopping & Batoning.

In order to really test how the knife holds up in hard work, I picked a 4" diameter log in Maplewood.
I have had it stored behind the garden shed since I fell it with the KSF Custom Bowie in 2008.
Now it's a lot dryer and harder!

Chopping



This Maple is a lot thicker and denser, than I ever would use in an Outdoor situation.
But for testing edgeholding, toughness and how the knife behaves under heavy workloads it is perfect!



Anyone who has worked with maple knows how hard and tough it can be to chop through.



I worked without gloves to find out if the handle would create any hotspots or blisters.
It didn't!

The balance and weight makes it possible to hold the knife with all four fingers on the handle.
A lighter knife needs to be held more in a two or three finger grip to develop enough force to the chop.
There was no sign of twisting in the hand when the edge hit the wood.

Batoning



Now I started to see some trouble, as the wood refused to split easily.
I managed to get out small pieces, but had to quit after breaking 5 batons.



The batons were all weakened by beguinning rot, so I decided to move into the workshop for a better baton.

Before this I inspected the edge and made a few cuts in a splinter.



As You can see the edge is perfectly sharp and can do fine curls.
No chipping or rolling!

In the workshop I found a better baton and could increase the force in the blows to the spine.



Finally it was possible to split the wood in half!

I used 3 differrent techniques in batoning through the pieces.
Here I baton along the fibers.



Finally for the last split, I had to baton tip first as there was a knot inside.



The tip cut the knot cleanly in halves and the job was done, but man this wood was tough!.

There were no damages to the tip and the edge has held up all the way with flying colors!

You can see fine scratches on the side of the blade but the heat-treatment, geometry and ergonomics are to my liking!

Well done Mike & Crew!


Mikael






mongo
Master Member KnifeNut!

mongo
01-28-12 15:43.28 - Post#2436899    

That's a pretty brutal test... frozen dried out hardwood with knots. Pretty impressive! Thanks for posting the results.
Nasty
Master Member KnifeNut!

Nasty
01-28-12 23:52.50 - Post#2436957    

Interesting test, but in real life I would have gone to an ax to split that one!


"Life has a special flavor to those who fight for it that the sheltered never know."

Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
01-29-12 00:19.02 - Post#2436960    

  • Nasty Said:
Interesting test, but in real life I would have gone to an ax to split that one!





Yes Ray, me too!

In fact I would stay clear of such dimensions and hardness, as long as I could.
I don't know of a situation I have been into, out in the forrests, that have needed such timber.

To test the knife regarding heat-treatment, edge holding and ergonomics, it was perfect.

I'm very satisfied with the outcome and I regard the Large Bowie as a good choice.


Mikael

Nasty
Master Member KnifeNut!

Nasty
01-29-12 23:03.53 - Post#2437316    

Understood Mikael...I only meant that I am too lazy to work so hard when an ax would have done the job in three strokes.

That is one tough knife!


"Life has a special flavor to those who fight for it that the sheltered never know."

Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
01-30-12 00:57.08 - Post#2437336    

  • Quote:
Understood Mikael...I only meant that I am too lazy to work so hard when an ax would have done the job in three strokes.



By all means, feel free to do it Your way!

TKC still has two Scagel Camp Axe's left.





Mikael

OKBohn
Moderator

OKBohn
01-30-12 03:37.29 - Post#2437379    

What a great test...and brutal!

Nicely done.
Derrick
KnivesShipFree

SaranacADK
Master Member KnifeNut!

SaranacADK
01-31-12 00:42.50 - Post#2437680    

That was some torture test Mikael

How did the handle do with all that whackin'?
- Mike
BRKCA Mike #160
Founding Member



Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
01-31-12 02:01.58 - Post#2437704    

Mike, that is a valid question as I batoned directly on the pommel,when splitting the knot.

As I have removed the original screw at the pommel end, to be able to baton tip first, the pith core is exposed to the blows.

The outer antler shell was completely un-affected,but the pith had a compression.

To avoid that in the future, the pith has been removed to 60 % of the handle lenght.
The other 40 % are filled with the tang and epoxy.

The spine and sides of the tang was secured in all its lenght with epoxy.

The tang is 75-80 % of the handle-lenght and the pommel screw on this Carver model was only cosmetic.

Now the pith is replaced by epoxy + cotton fiber filler.
This is a lot more dense, than the pith core and the method is used by many ABS knifemakers.

The rest of the handle shows no wear at all and the handle was rock solid after my test.
It should be as I didn't use the handle as a lever to get the knife out of the wood.

I will do a fill with glue around the guard area, to ensure no germs will enter, when processing food or fish.

I'm thinking of using Polyurethane glue, as this expands after application and produces a gap-filling foam, that penetrates hollows very well.


Mikael

SaranacADK
Master Member KnifeNut!

SaranacADK
01-31-12 07:34.37 - Post#2437823    

Thanks for the explanation. I would have been very surprised if you did not see some effects.

What you put that blade through pushed the limits of the natural antler material no matter how fine the construction.

Replacing pith with epoxy sounds like a good approach to me but I know very little about knife construction or how epoxy reacts to compression.

I know it is good at adhesion... I guess time will tell but but bring an ax for those big rounds next time

Might also want to go easy on that expanding stuff too. Can it generate enough force to crack the antler? I don't know...

Extreme test my friend... Thanks for the description and great photos!
- Mike
BRKCA Mike #160
Founding Member



Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
01-31-12 08:47.26 - Post#2437849    

Mike

Properly mixed and hardened, epoxy's are unbelievably strong!

I have removed a Sambar handle I had on the NL2.
I worked with a heat-gun to soften the epoxy, but I had to split the Sambar in half and even then it was difficult to get it off the tang.

By mixing the epoxy with differrent fillers, You get differrent property's.
There are fillers like micro-ballons, colodial silica and cottonfiber.
Just to mention a few.

Makers like Jerry Fisk uses micro-ballons.
John White uses collodial silica.

As I'm a former boat-builder I like cotton fiber, as it also adds toughness to the epoxy.

Regarding polyurethan glue, the expanding forces are by no way near, to crack any materials I have used it on.

With this knife, like some of my other big knives, I will not take a hatchet, as I know this knife have more power than I will need in the Outdoors.

That piece of wood was indeed very tough, but Maple is a wood I process on a regular base.
Look at this thin Mora Triflex just after doing a similiar thing a few years ago:



In my book this is nothing extreme as long as the technique, heatreatment and geometry are right.

The interesting answer with this test, at least for me, is that the Large Bowie can take a lot of workloads and beg for more.


Mikael



SaranacADK
Master Member KnifeNut!

SaranacADK
01-31-12 09:49.45 - Post#2437871    

Great information - Thanks Mikael!
- Mike
BRKCA Mike #160
Founding Member



Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
02-01-12 01:29.49 - Post#2438135    


Here's the finished pommel:





It turned out better looking than the pith core.


Mikael


alltinsoldier
Member

11-04-12 17:44.32 - Post#2507426    

Any interest on doing this to anyone else's knife?
Mikael W
Super Moderator

Mikael W
09-04-14 06:17.57 - Post#2613131    

  • alltinsoldier Said:
Any interest on doing this to anyone else's knife?



I know I'm very late with an answer to this Q, but I haven't been around here for over two years!

The best answer I have, will be to find a craftsman where You live.
The shipping costs between the US and Europe, are in the $100 range!


Regards
Mikael


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